so tac got back to me, he upgraded from 7.7.4 to 8.0.4 and had a default 5 min https timeout and it remained in 8.0.4.
What's interesting is that that means someone changed all of our groups or at least a major chunk of them to 1 min.
What happens if you change the default from 5 to 10 min, then upgrade to 8.0.4? I'd be curious to know