Wired Intelligent Edge

So there is a requirement for a modular chassis Core Switch with Redundant Active/Active processor. I see that 5400r and 12900 has  redundant processor, but is it active/active? What switch would you suggest?

------------------------------
AA
------------------------------

Hi,

What do you need ?

For modular chassis core, it will better to look 8400 or 6400 product

------------------------------
Alexis La Goutte
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: Oct 29, 2020 04:42 AM
From: Aria adhiguna
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

So there is a requirement for a modular chassis Core Switch with Redundant Active/Active processor. I see that 5400r and 12900 has  redundant processor, but is it active/active? What switch would you suggest?

------------------------------
AA
------------------------------

Hi,

Modular switches that have dual Management Modules installed normally works in an active/standby mode. This is the case for the two switch model you listed.
But I agree with alagoutte.
You would be better off with Aruba OS-CX switches.

------------------------------
Luciano Carvalho
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: Oct 29, 2020 04:42 AM
From: Aria adhiguna
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

So there is a requirement for a modular chassis Core Switch with Redundant Active/Active processor. I see that 5400r and 12900 has  redundant processor, but is it active/active? What switch would you suggest?

------------------------------
AA
------------------------------

Strictly speaking, the same applies to ArubaOS-CX based Aruba CX 6400 and Aruba CX 8400 switch series: MMs work in Active/Standby mode.

Edit: gosh, I (was able to) gave myself a Kudo, unintentionally! this is something that should be fixed.

------------------------------
Davide Poletto
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: Oct 30, 2020 10:00 AM
From: Luciano Carvalho
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

Hi,

Modular switches that have dual Management Modules installed normally works in an active/standby mode. This is the case for the two switch model you listed.
But I agree with alagoutte.
You would be better off with Aruba OS-CX switches.

------------------------------
Luciano Carvalho

Original Message:
Sent: Oct 29, 2020 04:42 AM
From: Aria adhiguna
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

So there is a requirement for a modular chassis Core Switch with Redundant Active/Active processor. I see that 5400r and 12900 has  redundant processor, but is it active/active? What switch would you suggest?

------------------------------
AA
------------------------------

So it generally only works on Active/Standby mode, even for OS-CX? Thank you everyone.

------------------------------
Aria adhiguna
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: Oct 29, 2020 04:42 AM
From: Aria adhiguna
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

So there is a requirement for a modular chassis Core Switch with Redundant Active/Active processor. I see that 5400r and 12900 has  redundant processor, but is it active/active? What switch would you suggest?

------------------------------
AA
------------------------------

I'm wondering; Why would you want active/active management module (MM)? The goal of the second management module is to take over when the active one fails, preferably without any downtime (hitless). This is possible with active/passive in the CX switches. Load-balancing is not needed since no traffic is going through the MM

------------------------------
Rene van Dorst
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: Nov 03, 2020 05:03 AM
From: Aria adhiguna
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

So it generally only works on Active/Standby mode, even for OS-CX? Thank you everyone.

------------------------------
Aria adhiguna

Original Message:
Sent: Oct 29, 2020 04:42 AM
From: Aria adhiguna
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

So there is a requirement for a modular chassis Core Switch with Redundant Active/Active processor. I see that 5400r and 12900 has  redundant processor, but is it active/active? What switch would you suggest?

------------------------------
AA
------------------------------

I agree with René but saying that "Load-balancing is not needed since no traffic is going through the MM" is not entirely true...I mean...the question should be: What load balancing mechanism the OP is speaking of? given that the I/O is performed at line card level (I speak for modular chassis)...we can maybe consider protocols (read: applications) distribution among two, or more, MMs/MPUs [*]?

From that standpoint Comware, ArubaOS-CX and ArubaOS-Switch operating system could really be different (because the OS engineering is totally different)...clearly in a comparison where a single chassis is equipped with dual MMs/MPUs but also in a comparison when multiple chassis with dual MMs/MPUs are stacked by means of, respectively, IRF, VSX/VSF and VSF.

[*] on Comware (7) operating system i'm thinking of features like the "Feature-based distributed computing" or the "Single-feature distributed computing" directly related to MPUs availability.

------------------------------
Davide Poletto
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: Nov 03, 2020 06:05 AM
From: Rene van Dorst
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

I'm wondering; Why would you want active/active management module (MM)? The goal of the second management module is to take over when the active one fails, preferably without any downtime (hitless). This is possible with active/passive in the CX switches. Load-balancing is not needed since no traffic is going through the MM

------------------------------
Rene van Dorst

Original Message:
Sent: Nov 03, 2020 05:03 AM
From: Aria adhiguna
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

So it generally only works on Active/Standby mode, even for OS-CX? Thank you everyone.

------------------------------
Aria adhiguna

Original Message:
Sent: Oct 29, 2020 04:42 AM
From: Aria adhiguna
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

So there is a requirement for a modular chassis Core Switch with Redundant Active/Active processor. I see that 5400r and 12900 has  redundant processor, but is it active/active? What switch would you suggest?

------------------------------
AA
------------------------------

well im not entirely sure, but the customer requirement said that they needed a redundant processor with active/active mode

------------------------------
Aria adhiguna
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: Nov 03, 2020 06:05 AM
From: Rene van Dorst
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

I'm wondering; Why would you want active/active management module (MM)? The goal of the second management module is to take over when the active one fails, preferably without any downtime (hitless). This is possible with active/passive in the CX switches. Load-balancing is not needed since no traffic is going through the MM

------------------------------
Rene van Dorst

Original Message:
Sent: Nov 03, 2020 05:03 AM
From: Aria adhiguna
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

So it generally only works on Active/Standby mode, even for OS-CX? Thank you everyone.

------------------------------
Aria adhiguna

Original Message:
Sent: Oct 29, 2020 04:42 AM
From: Aria adhiguna
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

So there is a requirement for a modular chassis Core Switch with Redundant Active/Active processor. I see that 5400r and 12900 has  redundant processor, but is it active/active? What switch would you suggest?

------------------------------
AA
------------------------------

Yes.
As parnassus wrote before, this is true for the CX switches and also for for all dual management module switches that I know off.
Maybe if you share what are your requirements we can help you with some information on the best design options.

------------------------------
Luciano Carvalho
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: Nov 03, 2020 05:03 AM
From: Aria adhiguna
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

So it generally only works on Active/Standby mode, even for OS-CX? Thank you everyone.

------------------------------
Aria adhiguna

Original Message:
Sent: Oct 29, 2020 04:42 AM
From: Aria adhiguna
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

So there is a requirement for a modular chassis Core Switch with Redundant Active/Active processor. I see that 5400r and 12900 has  redundant processor, but is it active/active? What switch would you suggest?

------------------------------
AA
------------------------------

On AOS-CX chassis (and as well on VSF stack), the standby module have some dormant processes ready to start if active MM fails.
This is the case for many daemons (ex: routing, bfd, and so forth) so that switchover is hitless. Typically, protocols will restart for service continuity before their associated "dead-timer" expires.
In addition, the system database is copied from active to standby, to maintain all data/information computed by active MM for handling network services.
So when active MM fails, standby has everything. 


------------------------------
Vincent Giles
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: Nov 03, 2020 07:28 AM
From: Luciano Carvalho
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

Yes.
As parnassus wrote before, this is true for the CX switches and also for for all dual management module switches that I know off.
Maybe if you share what are your requirements we can help you with some information on the best design options.

------------------------------
Luciano Carvalho

Original Message:
Sent: Nov 03, 2020 05:03 AM
From: Aria adhiguna
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

So it generally only works on Active/Standby mode, even for OS-CX? Thank you everyone.

------------------------------
Aria adhiguna

Original Message:
Sent: Oct 29, 2020 04:42 AM
From: Aria adhiguna
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

So there is a requirement for a modular chassis Core Switch with Redundant Active/Active processor. I see that 5400r and 12900 has  redundant processor, but is it active/active? What switch would you suggest?

------------------------------
AA
------------------------------

Hi Giles!

Just a note.

You wrote that "On AOS-CX chassis (and as well on VSF stack), the standby module have some dormant processes ready to start if active MM fails.".

IMHO, in the specific case of a VSF Stack - and I mean the additional case where one (or both) chassis member of a VSF has two MMs installed (I noted that you were referring to standby module paired with a VSF Stack...thus implying one or both VSF Chassis has two MMs instead of just the common one) - things work quite differently:

The second MMs installed on a VSF Chassis is not in standby (indeed it's not possible to benefit from a software feature like the "redundant management" - deployed as "Warm Standby mode", the default, or as "NonStop Switching mode") and the reason is that VSF "supports" the secondary MMs on a chassis but it shuts down it (the non-active MM...which is referred to by the switch as an "alternate" MM instead of "standby" MM). This, at least, was the explanation given by Matthew Fern here almost two years ago (Still I have doubts about some procedures...).

Long story short: on a Aruba 5400R zl2 VSF where one (or both chassis) is equipped with two MMs the "non-active" MM isn't placed in standby and hasn't any process running on it (AFAIK) because it's simply shut down during the VSF deployment...thus...no synchronous or asynchronous synchronizations could happen within that specific chassis between both MMs.

It's clear that on the above scenario when the active MM (AMM) fails the entire chassis is going to reboot to let the alternate MM (the second MM) powers on at reboot and take over the management duties.

Is that wrong?

On the other hand in a NON VSF scenario where an Aruba 5400R zl2 has dual MMs installed on its chassis the redundancy is simply handled with the "redundant management" software feature ("Warm Standby mode" - default - or "NonStop Switching mode") so, in this particular and common case, both MMs are really "in use" - let me the term - concurrently while redundant modes behave quite differently.




------------------------------
Davide Poletto
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: Nov 10, 2020 08:23 AM
From: Vincent Giles
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

On AOS-CX chassis (and as well on VSF stack), the standby module have some dormant processes ready to start if active MM fails.
This is the case for many daemons (ex: routing, bfd, and so forth) so that switchover is hitless. Typically, protocols will restart for service continuity before their associated "dead-timer" expires.
In addition, the system database is copied from active to standby, to maintain all data/information computed by active MM for handling network services.
So when active MM fails, standby has everything. 


------------------------------
Vincent Giles

Original Message:
Sent: Nov 03, 2020 07:28 AM
From: Luciano Carvalho
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

Yes.
As parnassus wrote before, this is true for the CX switches and also for for all dual management module switches that I know off.
Maybe if you share what are your requirements we can help you with some information on the best design options.

------------------------------
Luciano Carvalho

Original Message:
Sent: Nov 03, 2020 05:03 AM
From: Aria adhiguna
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

So it generally only works on Active/Standby mode, even for OS-CX? Thank you everyone.

------------------------------
Aria adhiguna

Original Message:
Sent: Oct 29, 2020 04:42 AM
From: Aria adhiguna
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

So there is a requirement for a modular chassis Core Switch with Redundant Active/Active processor. I see that 5400r and 12900 has  redundant processor, but is it active/active? What switch would you suggest?

------------------------------
AA
------------------------------

I was specifically talking about AOS-CX case (not 5400).
Regards,
Vincent

------------------------------
Vincent Giles
Distinguished Technical Marketing Engineer
HPE
Grenoble
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: Nov 11, 2020 04:02 AM
From: Davide Poletto
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

Hi Giles!

Just a note.

You wrote that "On AOS-CX chassis (and as well on VSF stack), the standby module have some dormant processes ready to start if active MM fails.".

IMHO, in the specific case of a VSF Stack - and I mean the additional case where one (or both) chassis member of a VSF has two MMs installed (I noted that you were referring to standby module paired with a VSF Stack...thus implying one or both VSF Chassis has two MMs instead of just the common one) - things work quite differently:

The second MMs installed on a VSF Chassis is not in standby (indeed it's not possible to benefit from a software feature like the "redundant management" - deployed as "Warm Standby mode", the default, or as "NonStop Switching mode") and the reason is that VSF "supports" the secondary MMs on a chassis but it shuts down it (the non-active MM...which is referred to by the switch as an "alternate" MM instead of "standby" MM). This, at least, was the explanation given by Matthew Fern here almost two years ago (Still I have doubts about some procedures...).

Long story short: on a Aruba 5400R zl2 VSF where one (or both chassis) is equipped with two MMs the "non-active" MM isn't placed in standby and hasn't any process running on it (AFAIK) because it's simply shut down during the VSF deployment...thus...no synchronous or asynchronous synchronizations could happen within that specific chassis between both MMs.

It's clear that on the above scenario when the active MM (AMM) fails the entire chassis is going to reboot to let the alternate MM (the second MM) powers on at reboot and take over the management duties.

Is that wrong?

On the other hand in a NON VSF scenario where an Aruba 5400R zl2 has dual MMs installed on its chassis the redundancy is simply handled with the "redundant management" software feature ("Warm Standby mode" - default - or "NonStop Switching mode") so, in this particular and common case, both MMs are really "in use" - let me the term - concurrently while redundant modes behave quite differently.




------------------------------
Davide Poletto

Original Message:
Sent: Nov 10, 2020 08:23 AM
From: Vincent Giles
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

On AOS-CX chassis (and as well on VSF stack), the standby module have some dormant processes ready to start if active MM fails.
This is the case for many daemons (ex: routing, bfd, and so forth) so that switchover is hitless. Typically, protocols will restart for service continuity before their associated "dead-timer" expires.
In addition, the system database is copied from active to standby, to maintain all data/information computed by active MM for handling network services.
So when active MM fails, standby has everything. 


------------------------------
Vincent Giles

Original Message:
Sent: Nov 03, 2020 07:28 AM
From: Luciano Carvalho
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

Yes.
As parnassus wrote before, this is true for the CX switches and also for for all dual management module switches that I know off.
Maybe if you share what are your requirements we can help you with some information on the best design options.

------------------------------
Luciano Carvalho

Original Message:
Sent: Nov 03, 2020 05:03 AM
From: Aria adhiguna
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

So it generally only works on Active/Standby mode, even for OS-CX? Thank you everyone.

------------------------------
Aria adhiguna

Original Message:
Sent: Oct 29, 2020 04:42 AM
From: Aria adhiguna
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

So there is a requirement for a modular chassis Core Switch with Redundant Active/Active processor. I see that 5400r and 12900 has  redundant processor, but is it active/active? What switch would you suggest?

------------------------------
AA
------------------------------

Yeah, but VSF on ArubaOS-CX is deployable and supported only on Aruba CX 6200 or Aruba CX 6300 Switch Series (which - with regards to their CPU - aren't exactly modular) and neither of them use a chassis capable of supporting neither one MM (well...they have a fixed internal CPU board) nor dual MMs because, as we all know, those series aren't based on modular chassis...that's why I suspected that you were not referring to "VSF on ArubaOS-CX" but you were referring to "VSF on ArubaOS-Switch" instead...and the reason I suspected that was because you cited the "standby module" (a concept valid only on chassis supporting redundant MMs such in the case of Aruba CX 6400 or 8400 - both doesn't support VSF - when speaking about ArubaOS-CX or Aruba 5400R zl2 - which support VSF - when speaking about ArubaOS-Switch).

By the way, what I wrote remains valid if VSF is deployed over ArubaOS-Switch using two Aruba 5400R zl2 chassis (ArubaOS-Switch based) with dual MMs installed on the pair of chassis or with just dual MMs into only one chassis of the pair.

To recap:

1. VSF on Aruba 2930F (no MM modularity -> out of scope)
2. VSF on Aruba 5400R zl2 (each chassis of the VSF admits redundant MMs -> MMs work as: one Active MM & one Alternate MM <- restriction: on every chassi it is installed into, the secondary MM is taken offline by the VSF)
3. VSF on Aruba CX 6200 (no MM modularity -> out of scope)
4. VSF on Aruba CX 6300 (no MM modularity -> out of scope)
5. VSX on Aruba CX 8320 (no MM modularity -> out of scope)
6. VSX on Aruba CX 8325 (no MM modularity -> out of scope)
7. VSX on Aruba CX 8360 (no MM modularity -> out of scope)
8. VSX on Aruba CX 6400 (each chassis of the VSX admits redundant MMs -> MMs work as: one Active MM & one Standby MM)
9. VSX on Aruba CX 8400 (each chassis of the VSX admits redundant MMs -> MMs work as: one Active MM & one Standby MM)

------------------------------
Davide Poletto
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: Nov 12, 2020 03:47 AM
From: Vincent Giles
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

I was specifically talking about AOS-CX case (not 5400).
Regards,
Vincent

------------------------------
Vincent Giles
Distinguished Technical Marketing Engineer
HPE
Grenoble

Original Message:
Sent: Nov 11, 2020 04:02 AM
From: Davide Poletto
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

Hi Giles!

Just a note.

You wrote that "On AOS-CX chassis (and as well on VSF stack), the standby module have some dormant processes ready to start if active MM fails.".

IMHO, in the specific case of a VSF Stack - and I mean the additional case where one (or both) chassis member of a VSF has two MMs installed (I noted that you were referring to standby module paired with a VSF Stack...thus implying one or both VSF Chassis has two MMs instead of just the common one) - things work quite differently:

The second MMs installed on a VSF Chassis is not in standby (indeed it's not possible to benefit from a software feature like the "redundant management" - deployed as "Warm Standby mode", the default, or as "NonStop Switching mode") and the reason is that VSF "supports" the secondary MMs on a chassis but it shuts down it (the non-active MM...which is referred to by the switch as an "alternate" MM instead of "standby" MM). This, at least, was the explanation given by Matthew Fern here almost two years ago (Still I have doubts about some procedures...).

Long story short: on a Aruba 5400R zl2 VSF where one (or both chassis) is equipped with two MMs the "non-active" MM isn't placed in standby and hasn't any process running on it (AFAIK) because it's simply shut down during the VSF deployment...thus...no synchronous or asynchronous synchronizations could happen within that specific chassis between both MMs.

It's clear that on the above scenario when the active MM (AMM) fails the entire chassis is going to reboot to let the alternate MM (the second MM) powers on at reboot and take over the management duties.

Is that wrong?

On the other hand in a NON VSF scenario where an Aruba 5400R zl2 has dual MMs installed on its chassis the redundancy is simply handled with the "redundant management" software feature ("Warm Standby mode" - default - or "NonStop Switching mode") so, in this particular and common case, both MMs are really "in use" - let me the term - concurrently while redundant modes behave quite differently.




------------------------------
Davide Poletto

Original Message:
Sent: Nov 10, 2020 08:23 AM
From: Vincent Giles
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

On AOS-CX chassis (and as well on VSF stack), the standby module have some dormant processes ready to start if active MM fails.
This is the case for many daemons (ex: routing, bfd, and so forth) so that switchover is hitless. Typically, protocols will restart for service continuity before their associated "dead-timer" expires.
In addition, the system database is copied from active to standby, to maintain all data/information computed by active MM for handling network services.
So when active MM fails, standby has everything. 


------------------------------
Vincent Giles

Original Message:
Sent: Nov 03, 2020 07:28 AM
From: Luciano Carvalho
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

Yes.
As parnassus wrote before, this is true for the CX switches and also for for all dual management module switches that I know off.
Maybe if you share what are your requirements we can help you with some information on the best design options.

------------------------------
Luciano Carvalho

Original Message:
Sent: Nov 03, 2020 05:03 AM
From: Aria adhiguna
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

So it generally only works on Active/Standby mode, even for OS-CX? Thank you everyone.

------------------------------
Aria adhiguna

Original Message:
Sent: Oct 29, 2020 04:42 AM
From: Aria adhiguna
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

So there is a requirement for a modular chassis Core Switch with Redundant Active/Active processor. I see that 5400r and 12900 has  redundant processor, but is it active/active? What switch would you suggest?

------------------------------
AA
------------------------------

I seems to me your use-case is do NOT require a reboot when/if failing over between active and standby MM. Is that correct?  If that is the case AOS-CX chassis will meet your needs. CX continually syncs config and process state to standby MM. 
I won't repeat all the good information Vincent shared about CX and redudany MM's.

------------------------------
Kelly Small
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: Oct 29, 2020 04:42 AM
From: Aria adhiguna
Subject: Core Switch with Active/Active processor

So there is a requirement for a modular chassis Core Switch with Redundant Active/Active processor. I see that 5400r and 12900 has  redundant processor, but is it active/active? What switch would you suggest?

------------------------------
AA
------------------------------